clevermanka (![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png)
clevermanka) wrote2012-12-07 11:04 am
clevermanka) wrote2012-12-07 11:04 am
Entry tags:
Fluffer
Most of this post is fluff fluff fluff, but I want to point out this AMAZING article on "historically accurate sexism." So. Good. It's a response to this article on the Mary Sue, so if you haven't read that, you should read the Mary Sue one first. From the Mary Sue article:
I think we need to think hard about what the point of historically inspired fantasies are. I think the main purpose of drawing upon history to inform such universes is to take advantage of the cultural and artistic motifs that are part of our shared human folklore, and that’s it.
I’d argue that they rarely have much to do with exploring issues of the real history in question...Which is why preserving the patriarchal societies in so many fantasies doesn’t make sense to me. I understand the argument that we should not whitewash history, and I fully agree—when it comes to actual history scholarship. But abiding by the historical fact of sexism in a fictional universe that is otherwise not bound by historical fact, I’d say, accomplishes nothing as much as reinforcing the idea that it’s the default order of things.
That’s a problem because of the ways it still is the default order of things. Art has had enormous power to affect progress, but it can also have a troubling fealty to traditions both real and imagined.
PREACH.
So to that person who commented back to me (months ago) on someone else's LJ that he can't enjoy fantasy worlds that aren't sexist because that's not how the world works and having powerful women as a matter of course ruins his ability to believe in the world: FUCK. YOU. YOU. DOUCHEBAG.
Okay, moving on to fluff now.
Poor Loki
Here is a nice shot-by-shot analysis of the Star Trek preview.
HOLY SHIT BLACK MAGIC.
Speaking of magic, I heard via![[livejournal.com profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/external/lj-userinfo.gif)
orrin about another 2013 movie that sounds pretty spiff. Heists! Magic! Flashy effects! Ensemble Cast!
I also forgot that Les Miz opens in 2013, so add that to the Overwhelming List Of 2013 Movies.
I think we need to think hard about what the point of historically inspired fantasies are. I think the main purpose of drawing upon history to inform such universes is to take advantage of the cultural and artistic motifs that are part of our shared human folklore, and that’s it.
I’d argue that they rarely have much to do with exploring issues of the real history in question...Which is why preserving the patriarchal societies in so many fantasies doesn’t make sense to me. I understand the argument that we should not whitewash history, and I fully agree—when it comes to actual history scholarship. But abiding by the historical fact of sexism in a fictional universe that is otherwise not bound by historical fact, I’d say, accomplishes nothing as much as reinforcing the idea that it’s the default order of things.
That’s a problem because of the ways it still is the default order of things. Art has had enormous power to affect progress, but it can also have a troubling fealty to traditions both real and imagined.
PREACH.
So to that person who commented back to me (months ago) on someone else's LJ that he can't enjoy fantasy worlds that aren't sexist because that's not how the world works and having powerful women as a matter of course ruins his ability to believe in the world: FUCK. YOU. YOU. DOUCHEBAG.
Okay, moving on to fluff now.
Poor Loki
Here is a nice shot-by-shot analysis of the Star Trek preview.
HOLY SHIT BLACK MAGIC.
Speaking of magic, I heard via
orrin about another 2013 movie that sounds pretty spiff. Heists! Magic! Flashy effects! Ensemble Cast! I also forgot that Les Miz opens in 2013, so add that to the Overwhelming List Of 2013 Movies.
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Adds another flick to the list for next year. I can see where the majority of my entertainment budget is going.
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That's sort of what we do in our RP comm. The game is based on Team Fortress 2, which is set in the 60's, so we use the cultural attitudes of that time to inform our characters. There have, when we have permitted them, been a lot of staunchly feminist female characters to reflect that time period, especially in the context of a game that canonically has an all-male (although Pyros can go either way) main cast working in the manly field of mercenary work.
By contrast, because there was already a female Pyro with a feminist slant when I joined, my character in this comm is female as well, but she is not terribly feminist at all. A lot of how she behaves and interacts with the other characters is informed by her femininity and how she was raised within it or else by how she goes out of her way to suppress it because she doesn't want to be a nuisance when she already feels she is intruding on men's territory. Likewise, few people have been bold enough to have sexist characters as opposed to just extra chivalrous ones, but that is something we do permit and actually would expect, given the context.
The key difference though is that we are working within a time period that actually existed, albeit in an alternate reality, as opposed to some vaguely suggested time period that may or may not have even happened on this planet.
tl;dr historically accurate sexism can be used to great effect and character development IF that sexism informs your characters in a meaningful way as opposed to just allowing you to pepper your story with damsels in distress.
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So there's the thing: if you're writing HISTORICAL fiction, as in "fictionalizing events that did/could have taken place in history," then portraying society as inherently sexist is going to make sense. And as a matter of fact, stories that gloss over how bad shit really was PISS ME OFF. No. Show us how bad shit really was. It can be hard for modern people to believe how bad shit really could be, and recently to boot. Show that stuff. But that doesn't absolve you from having real, 3-d, female characters. Women still existed. They were still real humans. Show us that.
But in fantasy? You have ZERO fucking excuse.
I couldn't help but think of The Mists of Avalon while reading the essays. It's historical fantasy about people who might have existed (the Arthurian legends), and their stories have been around for centuries. But it turns those stories on their head by showing them from the women's point of view. And it does a grand job of showing how horribly sexist society could be, while still having complex, full, beautifully imperfect female characters.
There's of course a happy medium between "my fantasy society is super sexist and women? what women?" and "the whole plot of my book is women struggling against the patriarchy."
Just.....just put women in your stories. And make them REAL. IT'S NOT THAT HARD.
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And oh god, yes. YES. I'm so tired of 'fantasy' novels that just have the same tired misogynistic attitudes. It's FANTASY AND FICTION, people. BE CREATIVE, holy shit.
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Adds another flick to the list for next year. I can see where the majority of my entertainment budget is going.
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That's sort of what we do in our RP comm. The game is based on Team Fortress 2, which is set in the 60's, so we use the cultural attitudes of that time to inform our characters. There have, when we have permitted them, been a lot of staunchly feminist female characters to reflect that time period, especially in the context of a game that canonically has an all-male (although Pyros can go either way) main cast working in the manly field of mercenary work.
By contrast, because there was already a female Pyro with a feminist slant when I joined, my character in this comm is female as well, but she is not terribly feminist at all. A lot of how she behaves and interacts with the other characters is informed by her femininity and how she was raised within it or else by how she goes out of her way to suppress it because she doesn't want to be a nuisance when she already feels she is intruding on men's territory. Likewise, few people have been bold enough to have sexist characters as opposed to just extra chivalrous ones, but that is something we do permit and actually would expect, given the context.
The key difference though is that we are working within a time period that actually existed, albeit in an alternate reality, as opposed to some vaguely suggested time period that may or may not have even happened on this planet.
tl;dr historically accurate sexism can be used to great effect and character development IF that sexism informs your characters in a meaningful way as opposed to just allowing you to pepper your story with damsels in distress.
no subject
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So there's the thing: if you're writing HISTORICAL fiction, as in "fictionalizing events that did/could have taken place in history," then portraying society as inherently sexist is going to make sense. And as a matter of fact, stories that gloss over how bad shit really was PISS ME OFF. No. Show us how bad shit really was. It can be hard for modern people to believe how bad shit really could be, and recently to boot. Show that stuff. But that doesn't absolve you from having real, 3-d, female characters. Women still existed. They were still real humans. Show us that.
But in fantasy? You have ZERO fucking excuse.
I couldn't help but think of The Mists of Avalon while reading the essays. It's historical fantasy about people who might have existed (the Arthurian legends), and their stories have been around for centuries. But it turns those stories on their head by showing them from the women's point of view. And it does a grand job of showing how horribly sexist society could be, while still having complex, full, beautifully imperfect female characters.
There's of course a happy medium between "my fantasy society is super sexist and women? what women?" and "the whole plot of my book is women struggling against the patriarchy."
Just.....just put women in your stories. And make them REAL. IT'S NOT THAT HARD.
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And oh god, yes. YES. I'm so tired of 'fantasy' novels that just have the same tired misogynistic attitudes. It's FANTASY AND FICTION, people. BE CREATIVE, holy shit.
no subject
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